Click here to close
New Message Alert
List Entire Thread
Msg ID: 2722400 Republican accountability project +3/-0     
Author:bladeslap
3/5/2022 9:54:35 PM




Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722404 Not republicans  +1/-3     
Author:Old Guy
3/6/2022 12:13:16 AM

Reply to: 2722400

If it was true, the people Putting up those Have NO reason to spend the money.  They know it is not and they know majority of the people know it was a stolen election.  So the campaign is still on.  They are just trying to convince somebody, wouldn't work.  You place a idiot in office.

Bladeslap why do you keep this up.  You have already posted that illegal votes for Biden are OK and should be counted.  you don't care about our constitution.  



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722438 Trump said, says the election was rigged. No, none, zero evidence of +3/-0     
Author:TheCrow
3/6/2022 8:48:08 PM

Reply to: 2722404

Trump said, says the election was rigged. No, no'ne, zero evidence of significan election issues. Repeat- NO EVIDENCE of significant election issues, just Trump's hurt feelings and reflexive lies.

Trump lost. Not as badly as the pre-election polls, so he should be facing that and building on it instead of a completely unsubstatiated farcical self-aggrandizing bullshit whiney cry-baby 'everybody hates me' bullshit.

If Biden is an idiot and I'm no Biden fan, he's a competent idiot instead of vindictive narcissistic traitor.



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722441 BULL SHIT +1/-2     
Author:Old Guy
3/6/2022 8:58:23 PM

Reply to: 2722438

None of the the courts that clam NO Evidence has convinced the US Puplic!

And the election has been determined to be in violation of the constitution by higher courts!

 



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722456 The only reason people like you still believe it +2/-0     
Author:bladeslap
3/7/2022 7:01:08 AM

Reply to: 2722441

There's one person, Donald Trump, who keeps spreading election lies because 

1. He wants more of your money

2. His ego can't accept that he lost (That's part of narcissistic personality disorder)

His own Attorney general told Trump that it's Bullsh*** about his election claims

Every single court threw out the case

The fact that every court said "You have no case"..... his own sister and niece call him a liar time and time again...

That's not enough to convince you.

You need to look at yourself and not others, Old guy



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722477 None of your post is true! +0/-2     
Author:Old Guy
3/7/2022 10:44:53 AM

Reply to: 2722456

If it was, why the big campaign.

"Methinks thou protest too much"

Look! the majority of the citizens have listened to, read about and watch all the information about this and made the decision that the election was stolen.  As time goes by, more and more comes out.

Just look at your state, where did all of the Biden voters come from.  About 1.55 million more total voters than any other election. Your state even had a big contested governors election and came up short of over 1.2 mil votes, compared to the Biden Trump election.   Proving dead people don't vote in every election.

And we already know you have NO concern for what the constitution requires.



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722488 You are wrong again +2/-0     
Author:bladeslap
3/7/2022 1:59:29 PM

Reply to: 2722477

Old guy,

At some point, I hope you will come to the realization that Trump is a con and a fraudh. 

Barr: Truth Irrelevant to Trump 'Big Lie,' Just Scared to Be a Loser (businessinsider.com)

From his own attorney general

Tump doesn't care if his election-fraud claims are true — he just doesn't want to be a loser, William Barr says

  • Barr wrote in his book that Trump just cared about not being seen as a loser, the outlet reported.
  • "I think his attitude probably is: 'It either was stolen, or if it wasn't stolen, I want people to believe it was stolen,'" Barr told the network.

There is no evidence that Trump's claims are right. A series of legal challenges to voting tallies around the US failed to make any headway in the courts.

 

 

In the book, he wrote that Trump would never concede the election because in his world, "a loser was the lowest form of life," according to NBC News.-----------------

 

Old Guy, Mary Trump, his on niece, warned us that Trump cannot accept defeat. No matter what. So he made up these claims so he feels better about himself, and he fooled you and many into believeing his lies.

The fact that you still believe it is scary..

They've all been disproven many times over



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722518 If it was, why the big campaign. "Methinks thou protest too much" +2/-0     
Author:TheCrow
3/7/2022 8:30:26 PM

Reply to: 2722477

If it was, why the big campaign. 

Because Trump is running the "Big Lie" as much as possible. It works with Trumpists. Offer the truth often enough and people will see Trump's lies.

 

"Methinks thou protest too much"

You talkin' about The Donald? No facts, just noise.



Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722478 BULL SHIT +2/-0     
Author:TheCrow
3/7/2022 10:52:31 AM

Reply to: 2722441

None of the the courts that clam NO Evidence has convinced the US Puplic!

And the election has been determined to be in violation of the constitution by higher courts

The majority of those who doubt the election results are Trumpist Republicans. That's a population that believes the allegations made by an acknowledged serial liar: Donald Trump.

Trump does not believe in elections: he believes he is entitled to the presidency. He is working to assume the office by overturning 2024 election results if he loses again. 

 

 

Viral image stated on January 30, 2022 in a photo on Facebook: “Over 65% of the country believes that (the) 2020 election was fraudulent. That number was around 35% a year ago.”
 
false
 
 

February 2, 2022

No, most Americans don’t believe the 2020 election was fraudulent

IF YOUR TIME IS SHORT

  • In several surveys conducted after November 2020, a majority of Americans said they believe the presidential election was free and fair. However, many Republicans still view Joe Biden’s victory as fraudulent.

Claims that the 2020 election was fraudulent have been repeatedly disproven through exhaustive audits, recounts, reports and reviews. But is it true that more than 65% of the nation still believes the narrative has merit?

No. But a widely shared Facebook claim asserts just as much:

"Over 65% of the country believes that (the) 2020 election was fraudulent. That number was around 35% a year ago," the Jan. 30 post claimed in words above a photo.

This post was flagged as part of Facebook’s efforts to combat false news and misinformation on its News Feed. (Read more about our partnership with Facebook.)

We reviewed 14 surveys that fleshed out polling on Americans’ attitudes about the 2020 election outcome and found none that back up this claim. However, surveys examining public sentiment around the 2020 election showed a clear partisan divide. Democrats typically believed there was no widespread voter fraud and Biden’s win was legitimate, while Republicans overwhelmingly said they doubted the election’s legitimacy.

In at least three surveys we found, the percentage of Republicans who said they didn’t trust the election came in around 65%.

The number of people overall who believe the election was fraudulent has hovered around 35% since November 2020, but this percentage has not increased significantly as the claim purports.

 

The surveys

 

A number of surveys examined public sentiment following the election. Here are a few with findings relevant to the claim:

  • Two Associated Press-NORC Center for Public Affairs Research polls conducted in February and July 2021 found that two-thirds of Republican respondents believe Biden was illegitimately elected in 2020.

  • A January 2021 Morning Consult survey of 1,990 registered voters nationwide showed 65% responded that they believe the 2020 election was "free and fair." But when those results were broken down by party affiliation, only one-third of Republicans were in agreement with that statement. When asked what sources helped lead them to believe the election was fraudulent, a majority of Republicans cited former President Donald Trump, who has repeatedly claimed without evidence that his loss was not legitimate.

  • A December 2021 poll of 1,000 adults conducted by the University of Massachusetts Amherst and YouGov, found that 58% of all respondents believed Joe Biden’s victory in the 2020 election was legitimate. Only one-third of respondents said it was not legitimate. Of those who view the election as illegitimate, 83% named "fraudulent ballots supporting Joe Biden" as the reason for their belief.

  • Another December 2021 poll, this one conducted by the Washington Post and the University of Maryland, asked 1,101 adults: "Regardless of whom you supported in the 2020 election, do you think Joe Biden’s election as president was legitimate, or was he not legitimately elected?" Nearly 7 in 10 respondents said Biden was legitimately elected, while 29% said he was not.

  • A Quinnipiac University poll conducted one month after the November 2020 election found similar results. Six in 10 respondents said Biden’s win was legitimate, versus 34% who said it was not legitimate. A majority of respondents in the Quinnipiac poll also said they did not believe there was widespread voter fraud in the 2020 presidential election, whereas 38% said they did believe there was fraud.

  • When Quinnipiac conducted a second poll six months after the election, the number of respondents who believed the election to be legitimate increased to nearly two-thirds. Respondents who said the contest was illegitimate dropped to 29%.

Despite Trump’s claims of voter fraud, no evidence of widespread voting malfeasance has been found in the several reviews and audits of the 2020 election conducted by the federal governmentstate officialselection security experts and news organizations. PolitiFact has also fact-checked more than 80 misleading or false claims about voter fraud in the 2020 election.

Our ruling

A Facebook post said, "Over 65% of the country believes that (the) 2020 election was fraudulent. That number was around 35% a year ago."

More than a dozen public opinion surveys found that a majority of Americans overall believe the results of the 2020 election were legitimate. However, many of these polls also found that many Republicans continue to hold the view that the results were skewed by voter fraud, despite a lack of evidence.

We rate this claim False.

 

Trump’s own officials say 2020 was America’s most secure election in history

Homeland Security put out a statement with state and local officials that countered the president’s fraud claims.

US Department of Homeland Security Under Secretary Chris Krebs speaks during the Department of Homeland Security’s Cybersecurity Summit on July 31, 2018, in New York City. Kevin Hagen/Getty Images

The 2020 US election was the most secure in American history, according to US elections officials.

“The November 3rd election was the most secure in American history. Right now, across the country, election officials are reviewing and double-checking the entire election process prior to finalizing the result,” the coordinating bodies on election infrastructure and security said in a joint statement issued by the Department of Homeland Security’s Cybersecurity & Infrastructure Security Agency (CISA).

The statement directly contradicts President Donald Trump, who has made unfounded allegations of widespread voting irregularities and fraud. The president is using these claims to challenge the vote counts in several key states that delivered President-elect Joe Biden his apparent Electoral College victory.

The Trump campaign has filed dozens of lawsuits, some of which have already been dismissed. But the barrage of legal action and Trump’s false claims — often bolstered by right-wing media and some of the president’s allies in the Republican Party — have undermined overall faith in the electoral process and in the safety and security of US elections.

In the statement, election officials noted that though some states may do recounts, “All of the states with close results in the 2020 presidential race have paper records of each vote, allowing the ability to go back and count each ballot if necessary.” This beefs up the security of the vote and allows officials to correct and identify mistakes in the counting process.

But the statement made one thing very clear: “There is no evidence that any voting system deleted or lost votes, changed votes, or was in any way compromised.”

Or as Chris Krebs, the head of CISA, put it: “TLDR: America, we have confidence in the security of your vote, you should, too.”

Learning the lessons of 2016 and fearing further foreign interference in 2020, CISA undertook massive efforts in 2020 to protect America’s election infrastructure. Krebs made securing elections a priority and received bipartisan backing for his efforts to do so.

In 2020, CISA set up a 24/7 “war room” that election officials could contact to report suspicious activity in real time, and had CISA officials at the ready to deploy to polling places, if necessary, according to the Washington Post. CISA also beefed up its public communication before and after the election on potential threats, including setting up a “rumor control” web page that debunks election disinformation.

Of course, countering election disinformation is infinitely more difficult when the president of the United States is the main purveyor of that disinformation. Krebs has reportedly told people he believes he’ll be fired soon, in large part because his efforts to correct false claims about election vulnerabilities has, not surprisingly, put him on the wrong side of the White House.

The 2020 election faced a lot of challenges. But the system worked.

Krebs and CISA are not the only voices here. America’s election officials agree that this US election was not only secure but incredibly successful given the unprecedented challenges states faced.

The Covid-19 pandemic forced election officials across the country to quickly adapt protocols, often with limited resources. Some states vastly expanded mail-in voting. Election officials had to manage public health concerns at polling places, like social distancing and sanitation, and had to come up with innovative solutions such as deploying curbside voting.

“The 2020 general election was one of the smoothest and most well-run elections that we have ever seen, and that is remarkable considering all the challenges,” Ben Hovland, a commissioner on the Election Assistance Commission, told the Associated Press.

The New York Times spoke to election officials in every state, including plenty of Republican officials, and all stated there was no evidence of widespread fraud or irregularities in this election. “There’s a great human capacity for inventing things that aren’t true about elections,” Frank LaRose, the Republican secretary of state in Ohio told the Times. “The conspiracy theories and rumors and all those things run rampant. For some reason, elections breed that type of mythology.”

Some states have begun running post-election audits; in Arizona, for example, half the counties conducted post-election audits, and none of them found any evidence of systematic voter fraud. That includes Maricopa County, where Phoenix is located; authorities there found no irregularities, according to CNN. Pima County, where Tucson is located, discovered just a two-vote discrepancy. The state, where he leads by more than 11,000 votes, has already been called for Biden.

International election observers from the Organization of American States also said they witnessed no fraud or voting irregularities. Another international election watchdog, the Organization for Security and Co-operation in Europe (OSCE), said the US elections were “well managed,” though they warned against Trump’s rhetoric undermining faith in the results.

As more states conduct recounts or post-election audits, discrepancies are going to emerge. But voter fraud is extraordinarily rare in the United States — just a handful of cases out of the tens of millions of ballots cast.

NYU’s Brennan Center for Justice did a study in 2007 that found the incidence of voter fraud to be between 0.0003 percent and 0.0025 percent, which made it more likely that an American would be struck by lighting than “he will impersonate another voter at the polls.” A Washington Post report in December 2016 found just four cases of voter fraud in that year’s election.

Trump’s focus on mail-in voting as somehow full of fraud also doesn’t hold up. In Oregon, which has been voting by mail for about two decades, officials referred 54 cases of possible voter fraud to law enforcement in 2016. Of those, 22 people — representing just 0.0001 percent of all ballots cast that year — were found guilty of having voted in two states.

Another analysis by the Washington Post and the nonprofit Electronic Registration Information Center found officials in Colorado, Washington state, and Oregon referred 372 possible cases to law enforcement of double voting or voting on behalf of a dead person, out of about 14.6 million mail-in votes in the 2016 and 2018 general elections. That comes out to about 0.0025 percent of all ballots.

Trump’s rhetoric undermines faith in the democratic process, but it also obscures the hard work done by election officials, ballot counters, and poll workers across the country in 2020. Beyond the logistical hurdles of Covid-19, the threat of foreign interference loomed over this election. So did fears of potential voter intimidation and violence at the polls. But with the exception of a few isolated incidents, the elections were largely safe and peaceful.

The pandemic also raised concerns about poll worker shortages, and that led to a surge of volunteers in some places, a trend that played out across the country.

Emily Hou, a 27-year-old who volunteered as a poll worker in San Francisco this year, described a long Election Day that began at 6 am and ended long after the polls closed. It took her and her colleagues about three hours after the polls closed to shut down the polling location, as they had to triple-check the number of ballots they’d received against the number of ballots the machine had counted.

Sophia Radis, an 18-year-old college student who signed up to be a poll worker in Madison, Wisconsin, saw firsthand the meticulous process of absentee-ballot counting: teams of two, handling just three to five ballots at a time, with observers present and election officials overseeing their work.

Kristi Critchley, who worked as a poll clerk in Pima County, Arizona, kept a running list of how many people had cast ballots, and then checked that against the number of ballots turned in — not what was written on those ballots, just that the numbers matched up. The numbers are checked, and checked again, and checked again. “I very much got a greater appreciation for how tight the process is, and how hard people are working to try to keep that as accurate and transparent as possible,” Critchley told me.

But maybe the biggest testament to the election’s success was the incredibly high turnout, with a preliminary estimate of 160 million Americans voting. With votes still to be counted, 2020’s turnout is now at more than 64 percent of all eligible voters, the highest percentage since 1900. A huge chunk of those voters did so early, either in person or by mail, another first.

Janet Boyd, who’s worked as an election official for nearly three decades in Arlington County, Virginia, told me that law changes before and after Covid-19 could have created challenges for both election officials and voters. But they were prepared and managed everything well, both during the early voting period and on Election Day.

“There could be some little mistakes here and there,” Boyd said of the election, “but I can’t imagine that any of them are to such a level that would create a change in the election results.”

 

It’s Official: The Election Was Secure

These government officials, judges, and elected leaders, overwhelmingly Republican, have publicly acknowledged confidence in the November election.

 
PUBLISHED: December 11, 2020
Poll worker looks at ballotIrfan Khan/Getty

Elec­tion offi­cials and elec­tion secur­ity experts have long been clear: voter fraud is extraordin­ar­ily rare and our system has strong checks in place to protect the integ­rity of our voting process. These are the facts. But the facts have not stopped bad actors from trot­ting out base­less claims of “systemic voter fraud” to suppress votes and under­mine trust in our demo­cracy for polit­ical gain.

By all meas­ures, the 2020 general elec­tion was one of the most secure elec­tions in our history. Voters turned out in record numbers to cast their ballots by mail and in person, and the votes were coun­ted in a timely manner. This success, however, did not dissuade Pres­id­ent Trump and his enablers from loudly claim­ing fraud when the race did not go his way. In a brazen attempt to over­turn the results, he unleashed an onslaught of outland­ish claims about wide­spread fraud in the elec­tion, shame­lessly target­ing the votes of Black and Latino citizens in several cities. The sever­ity of the alleg­a­tions by the pres­id­ent and his allies, however false, has elicited a resound­ing rebuke of the myth of wide­spread voter fraud from offi­cials at every level of govern­ment. And today, the Supreme Court all but ended the legal fight to over­turn the elec­tion when it rejec­ted Texas’s lawsuit to throw out the pres­id­en­tial elec­tion results in four battle­ground states that Pres­id­ent Trump lost.

Demo­cratic offi­cials and civil rights lead­ers have been outspoken about the strength of our elec­tion systems and their trust in our elec­tion offi­cials. And despite the alarm­ing number of Repub­lic­ans enabling Trump’s attempts to subvert demo­cracy, there is a grow­ing bipar­tisan coali­tion of lead­ers united behind the facts. What follows is a collec­tion of defin­it­ive state­ments reject­ing the myth of wide­spread voter fraud from federal agen­cies; the courts, includ­ing Trump-appoin­ted judges; and Repub­lican elec­tion offi­cials and elec­ted offi­cials. 

Federal Agen­cies

The nation’s top intel­li­gence and law enforce­ment agen­cies have confirmed that there is no evid­ence of signi­fic­ant voter fraud in Amer­ican elec­tions and that the 2020 elec­tion was secure.

Federal Bureau of Invest­ig­a­tion (FBI)

  • “We have not seen, histor­ic­ally, any kind of coordin­ated national voter fraud effort in a major elec­tion, whether it’s by mail or other­wise.” – Chris­topher Wray, FBI Director, Septem­ber 24, 2020, hear­ing before the U.S. Senate Commit­tee on Home­land Secur­ity and Govern­ment Affairs. (Director Wray was appoin­ted by Pres­id­ent Trump in 2017.)

Depart­ment of Home­land Secur­ity – Cyber­se­cur­ity and Infra­struc­ture Secur­ity Agency (CISA)

  • “The Novem­ber 3rd elec­tion was the most secure in Amer­ican history . . . . There is no evid­ence that any voting system deleted or lost votes, changed votes, or was in any way comprom­ised . . . While we know there are many unfoun­ded claims and oppor­tun­it­ies for misin­form­a­tion about the process of our elec­tions . . . we have the utmost confid­ence in the secur­ity and integ­rity of our elec­tions, and you should too.” – Joint State­ment by CISA, the Elec­tion Infra­struc­ture Govern­ment Coordin­at­ing Coun­cil (GCC), and the Elec­tion Infra­struc­ture Sector Coordin­at­ing Coun­cil (SCC), Novem­ber 12, 2020.
  • “[Elec­tion] Day was quiet. There was no indic­a­tion or evid­ence that there was any evid­ence of hack­ing or comprom­ise of elec­tion systems on, before, or after Novem­ber 3 . . . . We did a good job. I would do it one thou­sand times over.” – Chris Krebs, Former Director of CISA, Novem­ber 29, 2020.

Shortly after releas­ing the joint state­ment, Chris Krebs was fired from his posi­tion as director of CISA. His firing was directly linked to the joint state­ment in a tweet by Pres­id­ent Trump. In a 60 Minutes inter­view, Krebs reflec­ted on his agency’s work and described the Trump team’s claims of fraud as attempts to “under­mine confid­ence in the elec­tion, to confuse people, to scare people . . . ”

Depart­ment of Justice (DOJ)

  • “To date, [DOJ invest­ig­at­ors] have not seen fraud on a scale that could have effected a differ­ent outcome in the elec­tion.” – Attor­ney General William Barr, Decem­ber 1, 2020, announce­ment.

This conclu­sion was espe­cially notable in light of Attor­ney General Barr’s extraordin­ary efforts to support Pres­id­ent Trump’s ludicrous fraud alleg­a­tions. In a break from long-stand­ing DOJ policy, Barr announced in a Novem­ber 9 memor­andum that federal prosec­utors were author­ized to invest­ig­ate some elec­tion fraud cases before the results of the elec­tion were certi­fied, and noted that there may be irreg­u­lar­it­ies that “could poten­tially impact the outcome of a federal elec­tion in an indi­vidual State.” The direct­ive was roundly criti­cized by many former DOJ offi­cials and elec­tions experts. 

Richard Pilger, head of the DOJ’s Elec­tion Crimes branch, respon­ded to the move by step­ping down from his posi­tion. Twenty-three Demo­cratic attor­neys general signed a letter express­ing confid­ence that “any such invest­ig­a­tions will not succeed in over­turn­ing the elec­tion’s outcome, ” but criti­ciz­ing the move for exact­ing “the terrible cost of under­min­ing trust in the demo­cratic insti­tu­tions on which this coun­try depends.” In another crit­ical letter, 16 U.S. attor­neys who track elec­tion malfeas­ance noted that the “policy change was not based in fact” and confirmed that in their juris­dic­tions there was no evid­ence of substan­tial elec­tion irreg­u­lar­it­ies.

U.S. Elec­tion Assist­ance Commis­sion

  • “Time and time again, when the rubber hits the road, there’s no evid­ence — whether that’s in court cases, whether that’s in the pres­id­en­tial commis­sion that was created in 2017 to find the alleged non-citizens fraud after the 2016 elec­tion that cost, in his mind, the pres­id­ent the popu­lar vote, but found noth­ing and disban­ded in embar­rass­ment, or academic stud­ies. We never see evid­ence of wide­spread voter fraud. And there’s no indic­at­ors that 2020 will be differ­ent in that regard.” – Benjamin Hovland, Commis­sioner of the U.S. Elec­tion Assist­ance Commis­sion, Busi­ness InsiderNovem­ber 12, 2020

The Courts

The courts have emphat­ic­ally rejec­ted claims of wide­spread elec­tion fraud and irreg­u­lar­it­ies from Pres­id­ent Trump and his allies. Despite bring­ing roughly 50 postelec­tion lawsuits at the time of this writ­ing, Trump and his allies have failed to discount a signi­fic­ant number of votes, block the certi­fic­a­tion of results, or over­turn the results of any race.

In a number of these cases, courts have force­fully rebuked the lawyers for their outland­ish claims of voter fraud, egre­gious lack of evid­ence, and attemp­ted misuse of the judi­ciary.

United States District Court for the Middle District of Pennsylvania

  • “This claim, like Franken­stein’s Monster, has been haphaz­ardly stitched together . . . . This Court has been presen­ted with strained legal argu­ments without merit and spec­u­lat­ive accus­a­tions, unpled in the oper­at­ive complaint and unsup­por­ted by evid­ence. In the United States of Amer­ica, this cannot justify the disen­fran­chise­ment of a single voter, let alone all the voters of its sixth most popu­lated state. Our people, laws, and insti­tu­tions demand more.” – Judge Matthew Brann, reject­ing an attempt by Trump campaign to throw out all the votes in Pennsylvania based in part on unsub­stan­ti­ated insinu­ations of voter fraud, in Donald J. Trump for Pres­id­ent v. Boock­var, Novem­ber 21, 2020

Third Judi­cial Circuit Court of Michigan

  • “‘Plaintiffs’ inter­pret­a­tion of events is incor­rect and not cred­ible.” – Chief Justice Timothy Kenny, reject­ing attempt by Trump allies to block the certi­fic­a­tion of the vote in Wayne County, in Cost­antino v. City of Detroit, Novem­ber 13, 2020

United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit

  • “Free, fair elec­tions are the lifeblood of our demo­cracy. Charges of unfair­ness are seri­ous. But call­ing an elec­tion unfair does not make it so. Charges require specific alleg­a­tions and then proof. We have neither here.” – Trump-appoin­ted Judge Stephanos Bibas, reject­ing motion to block certi­fic­a­tion of elec­tion results in Pennsylvania in an unan­im­ous opin­ion, in Donald J. Trump for Pres­id­ent, Inc. v. Secret­ary of the Common­wealth, Novem­ber 27, 2020

Wiscon­sin Supreme Court

  • “At stake, in some meas­ure, is faith in our system of free and fair elec­tions, a feature cent­ral to the endur­ing strength of our consti­tu­tional repub­lic. It can be easy to blithely move on to the next case with a peti­tion so obvi­ously lack­ing, but this is sober­ing. The relief being sought by the peti­tion­ers is the most dramatic invoc­a­tion of judi­cial power I have ever seen. Judi­cial acqui­es­cence to such entreat­ies built on so flimsy a found­a­tion would do indelible damage to every future elec­tion.” – Judge Brian Haged­orn (concur­ring), reject­ing request to nullify Wiscon­sin’s pres­id­en­tial results, allow the state legis­lature to appoint its own slate of elect­ors, and compel the governor to approve said elect­ors, in Wiscon­sin Voters Alli­ance v. Wiscon­sin Elec­tion Commis­sion, Decem­ber 4, 2020

Elec­tion Offi­cials and Experts

New York Times Survey of Elec­tion Offi­cials

  • “Elec­tion offi­cials in dozens of states repres­ent­ing both polit­ical parties said that there was no evid­ence that fraud or other irreg­u­lar­it­ies played a role in the outcome of the pres­id­en­tial race . . . ” – New York Times,  Novem­ber 10, 2020 

    The Times contac­ted the offices of the top elec­tion offi­cials in every state. Notably, all 29 Repub­lican secret­ar­ies of state were surveyed, most respond­ing directly to the Times. None repor­ted any major voting issues, refus­ing to back up Trump’s portrait of a fraud­u­lent elec­tion.

59 Elec­tion Secur­ity Experts and Computer Scient­ists

  • “Anyone assert­ing that a U.S. elec­tion was ‘rigged’ is making an extraordin­ary claim, one that must be suppor­ted by persuas­ive and veri­fi­able evid­ence . . .” In the absence of such evid­ence, they added, it is “simply spec­u­la­tion.” – Letter from 59 of the coun­try’s top elec­tion secur­ity experts and computer scient­ists, Novem­ber 16, 2020
  • “We are aware of alarm­ing asser­tions being made that the 2020 elec­tion was ‘rigged’ by exploit­ing tech­nical vulner­ab­il­it­ies. However, in every case of which we are aware, these claims either have been unsub­stan­ti­ated or are tech­nic­ally inco­her­ent.” Letter from 59 of the coun­try’s top elec­tion secur­ity experts and computer scient­ists, Novem­ber 16, 2020

Gabriel Ster­ling (R), Geor­gi­a’s Voting Systems Imple­ment­a­tion Manager

  • [Claims of voter fraud] are “hoaxes and nonsense. Don’t buy into these things. Find trus­ted sources.” – Los Angeles Times,  Novem­ber 9, 2020
  • “It has to stop, ” Ster­ling said, react­ing to Trump’s sustained assaults on Geor­gi­a’s elec­tion process and result­ing viol­ent threats to local elec­tion offi­cials. – New York Times, Decem­ber 1, 2020

Scott Schwab (R), Kansas Secret­ary of State

  • “Kansas did not exper­i­ence any wide­spread, system­atic issues with voter fraud, intim­id­a­tion, irreg­u­lar­it­ies or voting prob­lems . . . . We are very pleased with how the elec­tion has gone up to this point.” – Spokes­wo­man for Secret­ary Schwab, New York Times,  Novem­ber 10, 2020

Kim Wyman (R), Wash­ing­ton Secret­ary of State

  • Of attempts by Repub­lican candid­ates to raise accus­a­tions of fraud, Wyman said “it’s just throw­ing grass at the fence at this point . . . see what sticks.” – New York TimesNovem­ber 10, 2020

Lisa Posthu­mus Lyons (R), Kent County Clerk

  • “We’ve just got a lot of checks and balances and trans­par­ency here in Michigan, and in Kent County we take that very seri­ously. I am 100% confid­ent in the results in Kent County, and I’m confid­ent that our canvass, once it’s all concluded, will valid­ate that.” – USA TodayNovem­ber 14, 2020

Elec­ted Offi­cials and Polit­ical Oper­at­ives

While the courts, federal agen­cies, and elec­tion offi­cials have roundly rejec­ted claims of wide­spread voter fraud, perhaps the sharpest — albeit surpris­ing — rebukes have come from key elec­ted offi­cials and polit­ical oper­at­ives within the Repub­lican party.

Ben Gins­berg, Veteran Repub­lican Party Elec­tion Lawyer

  • “The truth is that after decades of look­ing for illegal voting, there’s no proof of wide­spread fraud. At most, there are isol­ated incid­ents — by both Demo­crats and Repub­lic­ans. Elec­tions are not rigged.” – Wash­ing­ton Post, Septem­ber 8, 2020
  • “Proof of system­atic fraud has become the Loch Ness Monster of the Repub­lican Party. People have spent a lot of time look­ing for it, but it does­n’t exist.” – Wash­ing­ton PostNovem­ber 1, 2020
  • “As he confronts losing, Trump has devoted his campaign and the Repub­lican Party to this myth of voter fraud . . . . Perhaps this was the plan all along . . . disen­fran­chising enough voters has become key to his reelec­tion strategy.” – Wash­ing­ton PostNovem­ber 1, 2020 (Gins­berg has prac­ticed elec­tion law for 38 years.)

Karl Rove, Former Senior Adviser and Deputy Chief of Staff to George W. Bush

  • “The pres­id­ent’s efforts are unlikely to move a single state from Mr. Biden’s column, and certainly they’re not enough to change the final outcome.” – Wall Street JournalNovem­ber 11, 2020
  • “Mr. Trump must prove systemic fraud, with illegal votes in the tens of thou­sands. There is no evid­ence of that so far.” – Wall Street JournalNovem­ber 11, 2020

Letter from 31 Former Repub­lican Members of Congress

  • “As former Repub­lican Members of Congress who swore an oath to the Consti­tu­tion, we believe the state­ments by Pres­id­ent Trump alleging fraud in the elec­tion are efforts to under­mine the legit­im­acy of the elec­tion and are unac­cept­able.” – The Hill, Novem­ber 9, 2020

Will Hurd (R), Repres­ent­at­ive of Texas’s 23rd District

  • “A sitting pres­id­ent under­min­ing our polit­ical process & ques­tion­ing the legal­ity of the voices of count­less Amer­ic­ans without evid­ence is not only danger­ous & wrong, it under­mines the very found­a­tion this nation was built upon. Every Amer­ican should have his or her vote coun­ted." – The HillNovem­ber 5, 2020

Adam Kinzinger (R), Repub­lican Repres­ent­at­ive of Illinois’s 16th District

  • “STOP spread­ing debunked misin­form­a­tion…This is getting insane” – Twit­ter, Novem­ber 5, 2020

Mary­land Governor Larry Hogan (R)

  • “There is no defense for the pres­id­ent’s comments under­min­ing our Demo­cratic process . . . . No elec­tion or person is more import­ant than our Demo­cracy.” – Twit­ter, Novem­ber 5, 2020

Iowa Senator Joni Ernst (R)

  • “We believe in honesty. We believe in the integ­rity of our elec­tion system, which is why I do believe that if there is fraud out there, it should be brought to the court’s atten­tion and the proof should be brought forward. I think all of us agree on that. But to insinu­ate that Repub­lican and Demo­cratic candid­ates paid to throw off this elec­tion I think is abso­lutely outrageous . . . to have that accus­a­tion just offhan­dedly thrown out there just to confuse our voters across the United States, I think that is abso­lutely wrong.” – Fox News Radio, Novem­ber 19, 2020

Utah Senator Mitt Romney (R)

  • “[The pres­id­ent] is wrong to say that the elec­tion was rigged, corrupt or stolen — doing so damages the cause of free­dom here and around the world, weak­ens the insti­tu­tions that lie at the found­a­tion of the Repub­lic, and reck­lessly inflames destruc­tion and danger­ous passions.” – Twit­ter, Novem­ber 6, 2020
  • “Having failed to make even a plaus­ible case of wide­spread fraud or conspir­acy before any court of law, the Pres­id­ent has now resor­ted to overt pres­sure on state and local offi­cials to subvert the will of the people and over­turn the elec­tion. It is diffi­cult to imagine a worse, more undemo­cratic action by a sitting Amer­ican Pres­id­ent.” – Twit­ter, Novem­ber 19, 2020

Louisi­ana Senator Bill Cassidy (R)

  • “Pres­id­ent Trump’s legal team has not presen­ted evid­ence of the massive fraud which would have had to be present to over­turn the elec­tion. I voted for Pres­id­ent Trump but Joe Biden won.” – Twit­ter, Novem­ber 23, 2020

Pennsylvania Senator Pat Toomey (R)

  • After it emerged that Trump called Pennsylvani­a’s Repub­lican state House speaker seek­ing help to reverse his loss in the state, Sen. Toomey told the Phil­adelphia Inquirer: “It’s completely unac­cept­able and it’s not going to work and the pres­id­ent should give up trying to get legis­latures to over­turn the results of the elec­tions in their respect­ive states.”
  • Trump’s frus­tra­tion with Demo­crats “does­n’t change the oblig­a­tion of the pres­id­ent’s campaign to acknow­ledge that they have not been able to demon­strate that there’s been fraud, not on any signi­fic­ant scale.” – Phil­adelphia InquirerDecem­ber 8, 2020
  • “That has been determ­ined by elec­tion offi­cials, that has been determ­ined by federal judges, that’s been determ­ined by appel­late court judges. That’s the opin­ion of the attor­ney general, who is a Donald Trump appointee. So in my view the outcome of the elec­tion is clear and that is that Joe Biden won the elec­tion.” – Phil­adelphia InquirerDecem­ber 8, 2020


Return-To-Index  
 
Msg ID: 2722497 When you are stuck in the level of Denial that Old guy is +2/-0     
Author:bladeslap
3/7/2022 4:52:10 PM

Reply to: 2722478

Old guy is stuck in a level of denial that quite frankly, I've never seen. I pity him that he has lost his ability to logically and unemotionally go through the information that's publicly available and reach the same conclusion that Pence, Barr, McConell, and every sane human being has reached; Trump lost and he lost bigly.

His own defense is "Most people don't agree with that". 

First, most people do agree with it ..

Second, the people who don't agree with it are the people who believe Trump's lies. He's the only one spreading them. You all got suckered in by a con-man. What else can I say?

He's conned people his whole life and he's done it to Old Guy



Return-To-Index